Gettin Fired...

[...ViCaRiOuS...]

Anyone getting laid off, or know anyone getting laid off? Tough times huh... I’m working on my 3rd year on the job, and I’m kinda scared. I’m even testing again. I just took the test for Burbank with 10,000 other people. Got OCFA coming up with who knows how many people. Didn't pass the Torrance test, even if it was the SAME TEST I took and passed where I work now. LA City and County look inviting too. At least the mayor of LA said that he is going to protect Fire and Police. Nice to know that at least one guy in politics cares about his guys. And now I’m mad at myself for not working there along time ago. LIVE AND LEARN.....

[Ash702]

I understand you being nervous, but is testing for other departments the answer? You have 3 years in where you are at, but if you go to another department, you will be starting from the bottom as a rookie again! Now I don't know exactly where you work or how old you are or how much seniority you have within your department, but as long as you got guys below you, you should be ok. Unless your department really is small or stagnant, I wouldn't want to start over. I would have a hard time playing the Rookie game again.
I've been with my Department for almost 6 years now, and I am moving up the seniority ladder pretty well. No where near the top, but far from the bottom now....I think there have been at least 5 or 6 classes after mine. Plus, out here in Vegas, we may be in a recession, but I don't think we're in danger of losing guys. Our Chief just came out with a new 10 year plan with 10 stations in the works and approx 300 personnel!! Here is to hoping!!
If any one is facing lay offs, I feel bad for ya and will keep my fellow brothers in my thoughts and keep my fingers crossed. Good luck to us all!!

[trkmant46]

With the economy going the way it is, I would not be surprised if more FF's get pink slips! Its already occurring in other parts of the country including Ca.!
If you have a good chief and good union President, Be up front with them and ask them how the city's budget is looking. Is the dept's finances looking bleak, or is everything status quo? If they really care, they will tell you.
Also, ask them worst case scenario: If lays off take place, will senority be the only factor, or will "speciality" ranks/positions (FF/PM's) be the deciding factor? I know a few dept's have kept the medics and let the FF's go to keep their ALS response capability

Good luck

[maddog411]

Sometimes I think that working for a private fire department is not always the best thing. But in tough times like now, we have not heard ANY talk of layoffs.

But I have to take care of my own retirement.
I am still contemplating getting out there into a municipality. Trying to take a look at the bigger picture. I won't be young forever, and I would like a pension from PERS or a County system on top of my 457 plan.

Good Luck man.

[Cab911]

I keep hearing people say the "Last Hired, First Fired" statement. What worries me is what Trkman is saying about laying off FF's and keeping less senior FF/PM's. There are a lot more FF/PM's under me then just FF's, so the way they go about laying people off can really make a difference. :eek:

[ladderpiper]

I brought up state cutbacks from ARNIE in the Wildland forums and not many responded to that. But now that the muni's are crying the blues it's a hot topic.

Listen guys, I hate the fact that everyone is worried. We went through that here too. Guys are saying "who's going" and "I hope it does not go 20 people deep."

The fact of the matter is for us, we have been hearing the feds and the state say they will cut back since last year.

This will all work itself out. Fire season is going to be crazy this year and they will see how many MORE people we ALL need.

LA City is not all it is cracked up to be. If Vicarious wants to test elsewhere after having 3 years on the job, then he should go somewhere where the probation is not over the top like LA. They are a good department, but I think they can be a bit much. My buddy works there and he says that the job is the same there as it was in his last city department, except you are on probation for 5 to 10 years.

Cities will always cry the thin wallet game during hard times. It is up to us to get measures for more fire protection funds passed immediately after disasters. Strike while the iron is hot.

This year, the last 3 months have been the DRIEST months on record consecutively. Things will be wild this year. Bad timing for cutbacks!

[trkmant46]

Hey guys, first let me say that my comments about the lesser senior FF/PM staying over the more senior FF is only hear say. I do remember reading that a calif. dept. did give pink slips to FF's and it went by rank/speciality.
That happened back in the early late 80's and early 90's when we were going through budget woes -state wide.
Again, that is something that you need to ask your Chief and Union president. The only way to know is ask and be honest with them. If they really care about the Firefighters, they will tell you what direction the dept is heading, good, bad or otherwise!

Here is something else to consider: We have a great retirement system in california, but remember that OC board of supervisors are working VERY hard to remove the 3 @50 formula and the state is also working on the same deal. People state wide would love to see us under a 457plan. So just be careful when considering the retirement as a reason to move. I know mu union and others are fighting very hard to keep it, lets see if it works.

Cities and counties always threaten lays off, but when it comes down to laying off workers, Public safety is usually given a stay of execution!

[firemedic301]

Ladderpiper is on the money with his post!!! I ride with the FirePolice Motocross, which affords me the opportunity to spend alot of time with guy's from many different Depts. and some of my best friends work for LA City and LA County. I have found that bigger isn't always better. I am hard pressed to think that in this day and age, Lay-offs in the fire service are almost a non-existant point. Other than a Dept. not filling vacated spots, the FD and PD (floor personnel)are very safe!!!! They will ALWAYS cut Water, Power, Social service, Park and Rec. Department and Admin before cutting floor personnel. And if you are at a dept. that is talking lay-offs then absolutely test out before the ship sinks. Like Ladderpiper said, don't just look at $$$ as your reason for testing with a dept. look at medium size depts in a busy city that actually runs righteous calls day in and day out. One in which your first day on the job you are treated like one of the family!!!! Not an unwanted step-child that has to spend 5 years to become as bitchen as "they" are. Where you are on "first name basis" with almost everybody. Thats what makes you want to hang-it out there for your fellow co-workers when the *BLEEP**BLEEP**BLEEP**BLEEP* hits the fan. Commeradory, pay, types of calls, location, those are my priorites. Good luck VIC.

[fatcobra]

True that. I do remember watching my father's department in the 80s lay off more senior members to keep the PMs on staff, but I think for the most part that the IAFF unions have gotten away from it. As Ash has said Vegas is very lucky in that we have grown very quickly over the past 8 years, more than doubling in size. Is it good? Is it bad? I would say a little of both. But when it comes to layoffs, which has been one of the options, even here, I hate to say stay and find out. If you want to test, go test, it is always nice to have options. I like Ash, have been in Vegas for just short of 6 years (hey weren’t we in the same class?) and am very lucky to have about 150 people behind me in seniority. But, in perspective, Spokane FD, laid off 20 people in 2002 and the union fought to freeze them on a re-hire list. They did this because the outlook was that the city would not bring them back for at least three years and the civil service in WA states that if they have been laid off for longer than 3 years they must retest in an open hire. Well Local 29 did a great job and at least offered all of the 20 their jobs back. Most had already been picked up with other departments but the final layoff got his job back last year so kudos to Local 29.

Remember testing and other job offers, give you options. I would rather have options and control my future than to sit back and wait for someone to say, Hey bro, sorry but we have to let you go and not have a backup plan. Hey Ash, that’s why I am always in School.

[trkmant46]

Firemedic301: I am hard pressed to think that in this day and age, Lay-offs in the fire service are almost a non-existant point. Other than a Dept. not filling vacated spots, the FD and PD (floor personnel)are very safe!!!!

I would be very careful falling into that sense of security! We are never
safe from the choping block, although our unions and other would dis-agree, there are a couple of california cities under going lays in the very near future. So we are not un-touchable in anyway! It has happened before here in So.Ca. and can happen again. I like to think that the city or county would be able to work something out, but when there is no more money coming, something will give-JOBS.

We aren't the only ones, just got off the phone with a friend of mine who works for a mid-west dept. decent size for 15yrs. and they are looking at laying off FF's! No one is immune

[Ash702]

Remember testing and other job offers, give you options. I would rather have options and control my future than to sit back and wait for someone to say, Hey bro, sorry but we have to let you go and not have a backup plan. Hey Ash, that’s why I am always in School.

I thought you were staying in school to meet chicks?:D HUKED ON FONIX WURKED 4 ME!!

[firemedic301]

One thing this should make all of us aware is our Financial situations, and are they in order. What I mean is, are you one of the guy's that is super extended financially (two Mortgages (one at the River) the $50,000 truck, $100,000 boat, 5th wheel, $50,000 sand rail, Brand new SUV for the wife)? Do you have the "just barely making it on base pay" life style?
I have been around for almost 15 years in the service and just in the last few years REALLY made an effort to get my monthly expenses down to almost half of my monthly base pay. I refied and didn't take any money out, just lowered my payment. I have had my truck paid off for 2 years, I do all my own yard work ect.... I don't mean to ramble about my stuff but, I really want to see my brothers and sisters getting financially secured. And no I'm not selling anything, just awareness.;)

[Red Hot Truckie]

I too am working on only my 3rd year, with only 17 people under me (2 towers)....and all I am hearing is that I'm getting fired. Totally bummed. I am testing with other departments as well. Not to leave, but to have a back up plan. So if and when I'm kicked to the curb here, I'll be in backgrounds, hopefully with a department that has a better foundation.

[fatcobra]

Firemedic301 you make an excellent point about doing your own work.

[trkmant46]

Red Hot Truckie: What dept do you work for???

[desertmedic]

Okay, maybe I'm missing something here... Maybe its just somantics. Its not that your getting fired, its that your getting laid off. In the eyes of a new employer there is a huuuuge difference. Also, if your leaving one California fire job because you think you have little seniority, what makes you think as a boot your going to be so much better off? Not to throw FD names around but I recently heard that a big city FD in the IE just laid off a whole academy class recently. Hopefully this is not true because I really feel for those guys and gals.

[Cab911]

Desert medic are you talking about San bernardino City? If you are then that is not true, they where still here just earlier today.

Its funny how the rumors get passed on and they start a snowball effect into something way worse then the actual scenario. The only problem with that is that it can crush some peoples moral, especially if there job is on the line.

[desertmedic]

:eek: And thats why I didnt mention names Cab... ;)

[Cab911]

Its all good desert medic, i was just trying to keep people from speculating on what department you where talking about. Just trying to throw a little fact in the rumor mill. Its sometimes good to hear the rumors, but also good if everyone adds the facts that they know on the subject. If you hear anything more on the subject just post it here and someone should know first hand.

[desertmedic]

Hey Cab... I just heard LA Co FD is taking Berdoo City over! :eek: Hell, they took over La Habra... Any truth to that?? ;) And before we get into the "taking over" game I mean graciously accepted to provide service... :rolleyes:

[Cab911]

Hey Desert, i dont think the citizens of San Bernardino would except the decrease in service.......just kidding. Anything is possible, what about the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim.

[trkmant46]

Cab911 Hey Desert, i dont think the citizens of San Bernardino would except the decrease in service.......just kidding. Anything is possible, what about the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim.

OUCH!!! Although they can keep L.A. Habra-money looser...

[lvladder1]

Hey Desert, i dont think the citizens of San Bernardino would except the decrease in service.......just kidding. Anything is possible, what about the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim.

As long as they keep beating the LA Doyhers of East LA/ Echo Park... Light up that HALO!!!!!!

[sansoofireman]

What upsets me is Chiefs making $150,000/year and driving staff cars home when they live NO WHERE NEAR the city they work for (think about gas money alone) and talking about laying off firefighters. Someone needs to run the damn calls. Citizens won't go for a decrease in service, be it personnel or closing a station.

Can you belive this crap? Talks of laying guys off, and staff guys are driving city-owned cars with city-purchased gas to their homes, some of them more than 20 miles away. Seriously. Some cities even have Training Captains and EMS Coordinators with their own cars. Driving them home. Every day. With oil at $130 a barrel and local gas at $4.27 a gallon. Not to mention wear and tear on the vehicles. And not just sedans... most of these staff members are driving an SUV.

If the cars got taken away and it saved 1 job, it'd be worth it.

Just my 2 cents.

[Johnny on the spot]

ALSO, how is there this talk about closing a fire station or shutting down a 12 man engine company, yet the City Library is still open?

reading is for the literate... and it stopped being cool after the book "fahrenheit 451" was published in the early 50's.:D

but seriously... public safety over library cards. word.

[deceptacon]

I keep hearing people say the "Last Hired, First Fired" statement. What worries me is what Trkman is saying about laying off FF's and keeping less senior FF/PM's. There are a lot more FF/PM's under me then just FF's, so the way they go about laying people off can really make a difference. :eek:
You gotta live day by day...And be thankful that you have the best job in the world(for now)