VOTE - Will You Take a Pay Cut?

[Chile]

If YOUR Fire Department was in dire straits with budgetary problems, would you take a 10% reduction in pay or an equivalent reduction in benefit allowances in order to save the jobs of other firefighters?

[maddog411]

Hey, like I've said before in another post....When does it stop? What if you have to take another cut next year, then the next? Do you allow your pay to get 30% over 3 years? Because this bad economy is not going to end after 2009.

[deceptacon]

Mad dog...
Money over brotherhood....Thats how you roll?
Remember that the next time your on the fire ground with all the guys with 1-2 years on the job. They would risk their lives for you without a second thought.(FOR REAL) and you would send them down river for F#CKING 30%...DICK...:eek:

[KungFooPanda]

i would much rather city hall had really planned out for the doomsday budget 10 years ago and set themselves up like other cities from so cal had. then it wouldn't be so difficult.
and have the mayor give up his $2 mil 'special projects money".

deceptacon...don't be hatin'. maddog was just bringing up a good point. some city halls are just using this as a gateway into our pocketbooks to cover for the fact that they did plan rather poorly, and spent reserves when they should have been saving for the perfect storm.

[JKern78]

I agree with you panda. There are some contract cities up here that are being served by the county that have done quite well with the budget. In spite of the economy the staffing is not changing and the capital improvement projects are still going through. Two new stations and a significant remodel of another. Not any increase in staffing anytime soon but at least everything looks flat and not in the red. Shame on these other budget wizz people who run the finance departments to let things get to this. It should never get to the point where the membership is worried about layoffs or reduction in wages and benefits! These people make a lot of money to watch trends in the market and act accordingly. WHAT HAPPENED?? When all else fails and they did not do their job and manage the public money well the governing board should be ashamed to come to the public safety providers to cut staffing! Public safety is number one! People need electricity, water, gas, cops and firemen! All the rest is secondary. Once again the fire service is being asked to "do more with less!" We will as we have always done in the past make it work at the expense of our members. Sure we will add another engine to the response to make up for the shortfall, rely on auto and mutual aid more. We will always do the right thing for "joe dirtbag". I bet things will not go the same way with the copers!! I have a feeling we will take it in the rear while they will stay level. Why?? Because we always let them stick it to us! I would take a pay cut to keep my BROTHERS workin beside me but I would make damn sure it is written that when funds become available we go right back to the correct wages and staffing with no negotiating or fighting! We better make sure our ducks are in a row before we agree to this.

If the guys from City need the number to a guy that can make some stickers for your vehicles just let me know. I just need to know how to spell your city council members names! lol

[Livin' in GOD's Country]

I agree with all of you, but the fact is the City did not look ahead and we are in the problem we are in. Like JKern78 said "do more with less!", but now we need to to rethink for today "Do what we can with what we have".

But I will still give up 10% for my brothers.

[fyrglfr]

Hey, like I've said before in another post....When does it stop? What if you have to take another cut next year, then the next? Do you allow your pay to get 30% over 3 years? Because this bad economy is not going to end after 2009.
AAAAAAANNNNNNNDDDDDDDDDD, thats why you work for a private deptartment 411(Fort Irwin). I agree with Decepticon..........D!CK:mad:

[trkmant46]

When I read the original post, I had to ask myself, just how much of a pay cut can I afford, before it starts to impact my family? And honestly,a 30%-40% pay cut would be significant enough to impact my family. 10-20% cut, I Would do all day long!

And I have to believe that MOST firefighters would in fact take a pay cut in order to keep brothers and sisters on the floor.

However, at what point does the pay cut/reduction start to affect other members? Where is the line drawn? How much of a pay cut are Firefighters willing to take in order to keep lay-offs from occuring? Anyone??

I ask these questions, because if our economy doesn't turn around soon for the better, a lot us will be faced with a very difficult decision. Take significant pay cuts, or allow lay-offs.

In two recent posts, maddog was called a D*** for being honest. I think he is being a realist. I don't believe he is saying IGM, so Screw the rest. I believe (hope) he is looking out for his family and nothing more.

So, I pose this question to all the career firefighters in here. IF your dept. asked you to take upwards of a 40%-50% paycut (hypothetically) to save jobs, could you do it? Where do you draw the line?

Our unions can fight all they want to keep our staffing in place, but when the money is not there, what is a city or county government going to do? A lot of people are out of work due to our economy, and unfortunately we are not going to be immune to loosing positions.

This is one reason why we have senority. I don't mean that in a cruel way either. I CARE for all of the firefighters I work with and would hate to see anyone layed-off.
And Deceptacon, I will always choose the brotherhood before money. But there has to be a line drawn some where.

SO,WHAT WOULD YOU DO???

[ragu302]

Firstly, this is my first post, that said, everyone seems to forget what really matters BIG RED Shows UP! In looking at budget reductions, service reductions, staffing reductions the man always has a solution to cut across the boards. Never is it considered that if a building inspection or pre plan isn't completed will a live be lost. If there are only 3 mechanics instead of 15 fire trucks still get fixed. And so on. Being a team player is different than being a team member. Most team members see the advantage to losing a little income to keep the union seats on the books. There is and should be a line in the sand but the big picture should have some influence. And just in case you think I don't know wtf I am talking about, some 10 years ago I was one of 27 poor bastards sent packing for a 1 year layoff.

[Scuba]

Jay, hows this for an answer to your pole question. 133 to 1. To my SBFD brothers and sisters I LIKE THE WAY YOU ROLL. Brotherhood and sisterhood thats what makes us or breaks us. You can choose to be a FIREBRO OR A MOFO, I am proud to say I work with a hole bunch of FIREBROS!!!!!!!!!!!

[DeeDub]

a friend of mine told me 18 people got pinks... i hope you guys work it out. Good luck:confused:

[p1000]

Right on Scuba Iv'e never been more proud to be a member of SBFD. I sure would hate to be the one that voted NO. I'm sure he had a reason although we all did . I have to give up NASCAR , CIGARS and BULL RIDING. Along time ago my Engineer at Sation 3 the guy with arms like Popeye and his son work's at 221 taught me that "you learn who your friends are when you RUN , FIGHT or F**K"

That being said I recently asked some of the new guys who's heads were on the chopping block if they have been walking on weekend's they all said "NO." I hope this recent show of unity get's them out there with us. Once again thank all of you that voted YES and like you young guy's say "RESPECT!!!!"

BOB ON THIS

[JKern78]

Thats good to hear guys!..... what happens now?

[p1000]

Were going to give uo 10% of salary to pay our medical ins. Also 16 hours a month Furlough.

BOB ON THIS

[JKern78]

How are you guys approaching this with the city? Is this agreement going to sunset? Have an end date? What is the term and are you going to include language to automatically go back when the budget Looks better? I am just wondering what kind of safe guards are going to be in place or will you have to negotiate this back.

[Scuba]

Yes, we have several sunsets in place. The City has told us this is for a 18 mo period of time, but can not promise it wont go longer or that they will not come back to us for more next year sometime. Therefore are E-Board has done a remarkable job with help from legal council to place several trigger points were we would go back to our previous status including filling vacancies that we are leaving open. I want to say that are union E-board has done a great job through these very difficult times. They had to make some very hard decisions that effect a number of our members including others that are no longer in are bargaining group, but were dues paying members for many years prior to getting promoted. I am the first to say that I have not always supported the decisions our E-board has made in the past and have been pretty vocal about it. But I have learned a lot through this crises about the political process that they often have to deal with. I understand better now why they make some of those decisions and even though we may not agree I do feel they are looking out for the entire membership and the future of our organization.

[RedBloodedAmerican]

Right on Scuba Iv'e never been more proud to be a member of SBFD. I sure would hate to be the one that voted NO. I'm sure he had a reason although we all did . I have to give up NASCAR , CIGARS and BULL RIDING. Along time ago my Engineer at Sation 3 the guy with arms like Popeye and his son work's at 221 taught me that "you learn who your friends are when you RUN , FIGHT or F**K"

That being said I recently asked some of the new guys who's heads were on the chopping block if they have been walking on weekend's they all said "NO." I hope this recent show of unity get's them out there with us. Once again thank all of you that voted YES and like you young guy's say "RESPECT!!!!"

BOB ON THIS

Popeye arm's says alot, full of piss, vinegar, and a god knows what else. But he's right, and I'm excited to hear the final outcome of this. Just proves those "City" guys are one helluva group of guys ( and gals)

[illdaddy]

Good for you guys to take a hit to save a brother (or 10). I know you guys are busy enuff as it is in the ghetto and always need the men.